Misc: Everything Else Starting Problem - Series 'C' BIG Single

Bill Cannon

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Ahhh... Mr Chalky is not on the system presently for me to PM...Hell -I'll just throw it out there...are belt front pulley's for Vin's made of alloy? Or would it be suitable to use an alloy pulley, heat treated/annealed, may be a better question...;)
I have fixed alloy front pulley on my Egli 1200. 32 years now! But sadly only about 12000miles. But no problems.
Do not use an oil resistant belt they are not strong enough. Guess how I know!
 

Jez Nemeth

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Not sure what pump is in there -relying on John's original thinking here and expertise -knowing that he and Eddie were going to wring the neck of this engine, and do have some idea of what it was put through (Eddie briefly mentioned some very high HP figures for a single, but I do believe them now seeing it run and having examined the parts). So I'm assuming the pump put in it was up to the job. Can't see John taking shortcuts with something so essential, having put the rest of the whole thing together with such consideration.

Roy, need to speak with you sir for advice on another matter down the road ;) -but, yes that's really good to know -I do know the engine parts came from Conways in this case -bar the TP head, JE forged Piston. But your intel about the plating is absolutely worth knowing and gold dust -thank you Roy.
 
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Peter Holmes

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Peter -that's a really good question, so did some further checking on pistons if an alternative replacement needed to be found...you'll like this, I have an old VW T3 Caravelle Oettinger poptop form 1989, had it a very long time, been round the clock and 200thou the other side -ripped out all the VW transmission and engine -now runs a chipped 2.5 Subaru + ECU, made a cable gearchange, rear discs and I reversed the diff in a WRX Subaru gearbox to run backwards at a higher ratio with Exedy clutch...it's a Autobahn cruiser changing into 5th at just over a ton, top end god only knows, just plenty there and never wanted to go that fast in it to find out, it will keep up with Porsches and leaves similar sized Range Rovers for dust -quick off the start too for a 2 ton brick, but I only drive it around at 50, and 70 on motorways as it's our holiday home and super reliable. Point being, the pistons are good and super strong -and are exactly 99.5mm -100mm with rings -£60 new each and come in a variety of compression ratio's available ...the Nicasil barrel I have no easy answer for if that goes, except pleading cap in hand to Conways/Godden for another to be bored and coated...dread to think, standard £1500 -custom sizes be a fair bit more I'd guess..

Only other way would be to extract and machine a Subaru Barrel from a block -plenty about (Nicasil lined already), thereby creating a liner to be inserted into a over-bored Vincent muff with wider bolt hole diameter...that would work.possibly -doable anyway -but would have a shorter stroke, although there might be enough to get 100mm -they run 79mm, but barrel is longer than that because of different compression options offered across the range using the same basic block, have to check that one...anyway they're already in the form of a liner within a water jacket, and easy to remove and machine, two per side...

A guesstimate be something like -
Bore of 100mm divided by 2 = 50, then squared,( 50 x 50 ) = 2500 x 100mm (approx stroke) = 250000 x 3.14 = 785cc roughly(ish)...
Is sourcing a replacement piston as simple as just finding the correct diameter, don’t you also have to factor in the gudgeon pin to crown dimension, maybe skirt distance also.
 

Chris Launders

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When I had a front pulley made for my Norvin's belt drive I had it machined to take an ESA sleeve which was loctited in.
I don't have a cush drive at all unfortunately running a Commando clutch and Manx back wheel, I have thought of fitting one but after about 25 years still haven't got round to it.
My Brough has two !! one in the Norton clutch and one in the Enfield rear wheel, it certainly makes things smoother.
 

Jez Nemeth

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I had an ESA sleeve welded into a bored hole in the pulley, thought the splines would fit purpose fine -but clearly not tight enough on the crank stub nut -hence the rotational chewing. Looked at it again, and can be cleaned up I think without replacing. Think a machined out splined pulley will cope fine with the extra force of this engine starting providing above is observed -Thanks Chris

When running yesterday the homemade ESA seemed to work fine, but will check the feel against the solid one once I fettle that onto the crank splines. Good thing about the belt ESA is that it does fit neatly under the original cover, and there is elasticity there -but like most bike manufacturers with cushdrives, they're all at the outputting end of the drive train system, where the back wheel contacts the rigours of the world beyond the bike, not the start where the power delivery is...anyway, it's no further outboard than with a chain. and may do for now -jury still out on it.

Going to road test this weekend, because can't think of a good enough reason not to, and the weather is due to be accommodating
 
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Chris Launders

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A friend is building a Buell/Vincent special (Buell motor with a home made UFM and RFM to suit it) with Girdraulics and repro everything else and has made what looks like the drive side rear drum a cush drive unit.
 

Jez Nemeth

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Wow! Want one of those!!!
Was thinking about this and how sacrificing one rear brake drum to weld in perpendicular plates and fit appropriately sourced cushdrive rubbers or replacing with suitable sized diameter thinner steel tube or alloy casting would do it too...just thoughts.

He'll have an issue with the heads/carbs -two front, etc, or just get creative with the exhaust to make it look like it's coming from the front of the rear pot..that's a head scratcher. Good luck to him -love to see that
 

Bill Thomas

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The last Vincents, "D" s, Only had one rear drum,
For a lot of us One is enough, 2 Is a bit too much.
So not a problem to get rid of one.
 

Chris Launders

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Wow! Want one of those!!!
Was thinking about this and how sacrificing one rear brake drum to weld in perpendicular plates and fit appropriately sourced cushdrive rubbers or replacing with suitable sized diameter thinner steel tube or alloy casting would do it too...just thoughts.

He'll have an issue with the heads/carbs -two front, etc, or just get creative with the exhaust to make it look like it's coming from the front of the rear pot..that's a head scratcher. Good luck to him -love to see that
Well the Buell drive line is a bit further out so he has another bearing outboard of the standard pair with a longer hollow axle and the sprocket rides on that, the RFM is offset out on that side to match. initially it will run the standard heads but he has a spare front head to fit if it's successful. his biggest challenge is the engine/RFM is rubber mounted to the UFM so there are all sorts of movement and clearance issues.
 

Jez Nemeth

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What a wonderful project! So many challenges, no doubt he'll get there, it's so way beyond Billy Joel yammy Vinnie tribute already -but sounds a really well considered job... yup would need a cushdrive for that!

Tightened up the Belt ESA on the bike, as said still not sure on it, but it does zap the kick-start rotation inertia, absorbs a lot -part adds to the starting issue methinks. Sorted cable Decomp finally, battery charged so good for a run later, let's see if it starts on petrol, not EASYSTART -like weening yer kid off milk and onto baby food (and not too good baby food either -got 5-10% Alcohol in it, mind you my parents used to give us a tiny amount of whiskey and honey to send us off to sleep as kids when teething, there simply wasn't anything else...no Calpol, zip
 
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