• Welcome to the website of the Vincent H.R.D. Owners Club.

    Should you have any questions relating to the Vincent H.R.D. Owners Club, or Vincent H.R.D. motorcycles in general, please contact Graham Smith, Hon. Editor and Webmaster by calling 07977 001 025 or please CLICK HERE.

    You are unrecognised, and therefore, only have VERY restricted access to the many features of this website.

    If you have previously registered to use this forum, you should log in now. CLICK HERE.

    If you have never registered to use this website before, please CLICK HERE.

zero to sixty

Glenliman

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I gave the Glenli several good tries last night, best was 4.9 seconds according to the Dakota Digital speedo. The speedo was calibrated by gps so it should be very accurate.
This is with the donor motor, roughly the same tuning as a US Black Shadow (werent they 8 to one rather than 7.3?), but with the advantage of the Rapide or late Shadow lower first gear.
Disadvatanges are the 230 lb rider and the taller than stock gearing.

The light weight of the bike seems to more than make up for this. A faster shifting trans would help. The permanent engine will get that with the quaife.
It will be interesting to compare times with the different engines.
Glen
 

Glenliman

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Hi Bill
Yes, I used two gears.

According to my figures, 60 mph in first gear is just over 7000 rpm with stock gearing. My gearing is higher than stock, so it works out to 6600 revs at 60, a tad high for the old engine.

The numbers I have from the riders handbook are:=
Standard gearing = 4600 rpm @100 mph , overall ratio 3.5 to one in fourth. Overall ratio (standard) in first is 9 to one , so (9÷3.5) x4600=11,828 rpm, the theoretical rpm for first gear at 100 mph. 11,828 x.6 = 7096 rpm @60 mph.
Glen
 
Last edited:

Howard

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Hello Glen, So you used two gears ? You should be able to buzz it in one gear ? Don't blow it up !! Cheers Bill.

I think 4.9 and going home with a whole engine is better than 4.5 and going home with a bag of bits. :)

Your figures are interesting Glen. I've always guestimated my Egli at 4.5 seconds. Based on Shadow and Rap both about 6 seconds (according to Vincent Rider's Handbook figures) so if the Rap did 0-30 in 1.5 and the Shadow 30-60 in 3, a Shadow with Rap gearing should be good for 5 seconds. Take 50 lbs off for the Egli frame add a few horses for 32 mm carbs and 9:1 and a very slim rider (lol) ......... I'll take 4.9 quite happily. But I don't think 0 - 60 means a lot, Rolling acceleration times like 30 - 60 or 50 - 70 are more meaningful on a road bike.

H
 

Glenliman

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
The device also accurately measures 1/4 mile et and gives exit speed, although there is really no safe spot in my area to do that test. Might give that a trial out on some long stretch of deserted highway somewhere.
It is quite amazing how much is jammed into something that weighs a few ounces. In addition to the performance figures above, it gives highest recorded speed for each trip, highest rpm reached,. Under tach there is an engine hour meter, plus the tach display is available in four different modes, one in 10 rpm increments . The speed can be shown in both KPH or MPH or both at the same time.Other info includes miles to service, service warning light(set for oil changes or whatever) Gear indicator, high beam indicator, low volt indicator, left and right turn indicator on, shift warning light remote output and high rpm warning light. There is also a low oil level warning light and some other functions Im forgetting.

Glen
 

Bill Thomas

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Hello Glen, When I was Sprinting, 1970 to 80 I marked out a part of the A413 near London, But after a few runs the Police always turned up !!, Time to go home !! I have very little cash so I use a push bike speedo, That gives average speed, Highest speed, how many miles in a trip, Plus a clock. I must remember to reset it if pulled up by police, In case they know how to use it !! Have fun, Bill.
 

Glenliman

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
When I was in my teens , friends and I had a couple of locations. If the police showed up at one, we would move to the other.
Truth be told, our bikes/cars were so low in power that we werent all that much above the posted speed limit at the end of the quarter.
This was the era of the muscle car tho and lots of those screaming tire smokers would show up. The hottest of those (Mach 1 428 Mustang, Boss 302 Mustangs, Dodge 340 Swinger and 340 Dart, Pontiac GTO, Dodge Super Bees or Hemi Cudas, and certain Corvettes) might do a 13 second 105mph quarter mile at best, but the frying of those polyglass tires thru the gears is something I will never forget!

Glen
 

A-BCD

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
 

Glenliman

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
2.8 seconds to sixty would be roughly the same as the new 200 hp BMW 1000rr. Makesone wonder about the rest of the claims on th ad.

There is a Shadow 70 nearing completion here in Vancouver, stored since the seventies and being assembled by John Mcdougall. The engine is roughly the same tune as my temporary engine but the bike itself will be somewhat heavier.

Glen
 

davidd

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
This is from the CycleWorld test of EV10:

The performance figures: “In our accelerationtests we registered a 0-60 time of 4.3 seconds. Our best quarter-mile time was13.98 seconds at a speed of 98 mph. Average speed in a two-way run was 132mph.”

David
 

Albervin

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
The motoring literature of the '60s and '70s were filled with hyperbole and outright lies. What was really annoying though was the magazines in the newsagents never contradicted the factory figures. It was most obvious with cars like the E Type which supposedly had a top speed of 150 MPH but in reality ran out of breath at 120. A friend builds Jaguar engines and when he tells a customer he has a genuine 285 BHP engine now, the customer is often disappointed, until he drives it! 1 (factory)Jaguar horsepower =1 pit pony horsepower :) We are now having to put up with the same bullsh!t when it comes to official fuel consumption on new vehicles. Here in Australia the motoring journalists are finally telling the truth and so far very few have ever achieved the official figures during a road test. Discrepancies of 10-15% are very common. Slater Bros. made similar statements about the Laverda Jota they developed. I think the times and speeds at the Ramsay event in 1999 are what we need to use as benchmarks. Was a Mr D Smith FTD on a standard (?) Vincent?
 

Glenliman

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Same thing with fuel mileage ratings in North America. After the financial collapse and bankruptcy of GM and Chrysler, the big three realized they had to come up with fuel efficient cars like the Japanese had been building. As owner reports of various new fuel efficient models filter in, it appears that Detroit came up with new mileage ratings more than anything else


Back to the 4.9 sec to sixty, Im quite pleased with that. It is a real number, not something fudged by a manufacturer or a magazine hungry for advertising dollars. Standard gearing would likely shave a few tenths off of that, now that is in range of a Ferrari 550 Maranello. No wonder the regular traffic is easy to leave behind.

Glen
 
Last edited:

Howard

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
2.8 seconds to sixty would be roughly the same as the new 200 hp BMW 1000rr. Makesone wonder about the rest of the claims on th ad.

There is a Shadow 70 nearing completion here in Vancouver, stored since the seventies and being assembled by John Mcdougall. The engine is roughly the same tune as my temporary engine but the bike itself will be somewhat heavier.

Glen


I'm fairly sure mine was the last Shadow 70 Slater built, although it's evolved a long way form there, I don't think it ever had the performance quoted, especially 0-60 nearly a second faster than a Fireblade. The performance quoted in v) almost certainly refers to Ray Elgar, and I think rider and bike were a bit special.

H
 

timetraveller

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Some readers will have noted the comment by George Spence in the May 2012 MPH about the fastest production Vincent at the Blackpool Sprint having a quarter mile time of 14.36 seconds. That was me, at the time about 150 lbs weight. The bike was a carefully put together Shadow with standard carbs, compression ratio etc. but I think MkII cams. I rode the bike up to my family home in Wakefield from Sussex, where I worked, changed the silencer to a ‘straight through’, i.e. a bit of tube welded into a standard silencer body and then followed my brother in his car over the Pennines to Blackpool. I remember going through some of the towns and villages with the throttle well shut and not causing enough noise to cause people to look round. However, opening the throttle was a different matter!! It was my first ever motorcycle competitive event and I won, much to my surprise. Note that this was a more or less standard road bike, fully equipped with lights, dynamo, battery, front and rear stands etc. It is probably typical of what one could expect from a standard twin at the time. It took about two years for me to get the time down to 13.06 seconds by which time there were no stands, nothing in the battery case or dynamo, the compression was up to 10.5:1 and the ‘carbs’ were inch and three eighths Wal Phillips fuel injectors. The bike was still being ridden to meetings and generally the silencer changed at the meeting. As well as the 13.06 time for the standing start quarter the bike also did 135 mph at the end of a half mile sprint at Long Marston. Regarding the number of gear changes, I tried over revving to 7,000 rpm and making just one change or changing gear twice and revving to a more reasonable 6,300 ish. Times were better with the extra gear change and staying within the power band. Rear sprockets were typically 54 or 56 teeth for quarter miles. I had intended to build another bike with oil in the gearbox, a ‘D’UFM and Bramptons to reduce weight but circumstances decreed that I had to buy a house and as those of you who have gone through this will know one is essentially bankrupted and there was no longer the money to go sprinting. It would not have mattered anyway. For year or two I had had the fastest production bike in the country but the next year, Ray Elgar did something to his bike which transformed its performance. If I recall correctly he got down to about 12.3 seconds and I doubt that I would ever have got there. Even allowing for the lighter weight of a Shadow 70 I doubt that the claimed figures could ever have been achieved.
 

Howard

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Some readers will have noted the comment by George Spence in the May 2012 MPH about the fastest production Vincent at the Blackpool Sprint having a quarter mile time of 14.36 seconds. That was me, at the time about 150 lbs weight. The bike was a carefully put together Shadow with standard carbs, compression ratio etc. but I think MkII cams. I rode the bike up to my family home in Wakefield from Sussex, where I worked, changed the silencer to a ‘straight through’, i.e. a bit of tube welded into a standard silencer body and then followed my brother in his car over the Pennines to Blackpool. I remember going through some of the towns and villages with the throttle well shut and not causing enough noise to cause people to look round. However, opening the throttle was a different matter!! It was my first ever motorcycle competitive event and I won, much to my surprise. Note that this was a more or less standard road bike, fully equipped with lights, dynamo, battery, front and rear stands etc. It is probably typical of what one could expect from a standard twin at the time. It took about two years for me to get the time down to 13.06 seconds by which time there were no stands, nothing in the battery case or dynamo, the compression was up to 10.5:1 and the ‘carbs’ were inch and three eighths Wal Phillips fuel injectors. The bike was still being ridden to meetings and generally the silencer changed at the meeting. As well as the 13.06 time for the standing start quarter the bike also did 135 mph at the end of a half mile sprint at Long Marston. Regarding the number of gear changes, I tried over revving to 7,000 rpm and making just one change or changing gear twice and revving to a more reasonable 6,300 ish. Times were better with the extra gear change and staying within the power band. Rear sprockets were typically 54 or 56 teeth for quarter miles. I had intended to build another bike with oil in the gearbox, a ‘D’UFM and Bramptons to reduce weight but circumstances decreed that I had to buy a house and as those of you who have gone through this will know one is essentially bankrupted and there was no longer the money to go sprinting. It would not have mattered anyway. For year or two I had had the fastest production bike in the country but the next year, Ray Elgar did something to his bike which transformed its performance. If I recall correctly he got down to about 12.3 seconds and I doubt that I would ever have got there. Even allowing for the lighter weight of a Shadow 70 I doubt that the claimed figures could ever have been achieved.

http://www.vmccsprint.co.uk/vintage...ies/2009/10/13_The_Zandvoort_Sprint_1967.html

Is this your era TT?

H
 

timetraveller

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Nice article. That is just a bit too late for me. I have just had to go and look at a few of the trophies to remind me of the dates as it is all so long ago I could not be sure of the dates. The Blackpool Sprint was 1962 and the various trophies go up to 1964 when I ran out of money. However, I was invited to compete at the first Anglo/American drag fest and I think the second, so if you have a record of that you will find my name in there somewhere. Remember, it was always the production class. Professional astronomers are not the highest paid people and there was no way I could have competed with the likes of George Brown or Alf Hagon who had their own professional faclities.
 

Glenliman

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Interesting post, TT. Your 1/4 mile time of 13.06 seconds with the modified bike correlates closely with Dans 1/8 mile sprint time on his modified machine, according to a couple of online conversion calculators.
One reason that standard Vincent sprint times seem a bit slow in relation to the engine power has to be the sluggish change with the standard gearbox. The changes on mine take about 1/2 seconds, so in the quarter there is a full second with deceleration. The stock AMC gearbox can be shifted almost instantly under full power, although the life span can be short when used this way.I can see why it was popular to utlilize the AMC transmission .

Glen
 
Last edited:

Can't Find What You Need?

Buyer Beware: Fake or Real?

Top