Rattley twin clutch??

[vince998]

Hi All,
The clutch on my "D" twin grips like mad, separates instantly, and is bone dry.
The problem i have is a god awfull rattle when in neutral at tickover.
Pulling the clutch lever back and letting in "flick out" (presumeably taking up any play in one direction momentarily) alleviates the noise for a few seconds but then it starts again.
I´m using one of russels new primary plates (metal plate with bonden in linings) and this fits very snugly in the drum (also new)
On stripping down for the umpteenth time, the only cause i can find is clearance between the centralising plungers and their respective pins with the shoes mounted on the carrier, and the clutch nut in place. this allows a rotational movement (backwards or forwards) of the clutch centre before the plungers come into contact with their pins.
Should this be so, or should both plungers have contact with their pins in a stationary clutch, so effectively making the whole setup free of "unsprung" rotational motion?
Thanks.

 

[Pete Appleton]

Hi Vince
There is a bit about centralising springs in the thread HERE

Peter

 

[vince998]

Hi Peter,
Thanks for the info (and russ to)
Maybe this is where my noise is coming from although as mentioned before no problem with grab etc.
i won´t weld the pins up as they are relatively new as well, i´noticed the shoulders on the pins are quite thick so i´ll turn them down a bit and then check to see that i have the correct travel.
Is pins just touching, or a light "preload" best when fully assembled? (thinks: a light preload would allow for some wear on the plunger nose)
Once again, thanks Peter

 

[vince998]

Update:
I´ve reduced the plunger shoulder height so allowing the pins to protrude more through the shoes giving plunger to pin contact on a stationary clutch, and adjusted the screws/spring pressure giving the recommended travel.
Clutch works brilliantly (front wheel off the floor starts, perfect separation and still no oil leaks present)
The bloody rattle is still there!!!
Actually, its two rattles. One with the clutch separated (this is just the primary friction plate clanging against the drum and i can live with that), and one when in neutral on an engaged clutch (sounds like a shaked biscuit tin filled with nuts and bolts)
This can only be coming from the clutch shoes touching the inner primary plate, as there is nothing else moving.
The primary clutch friction plate has plenty of clearance to the drum so i´m a bit loathed to space the inner plate out with washers (do you have to shorten the 9 C15 when you do this?)
Has anybody got any other suggestions?
Thanks

 

[John Appleton]

Hi Vince, I presume this is still the same rattle that we all witnessed in Austria in September. I cannot answer the questions you ask, but I would not reccomend fitting the spacer washers behind the inner plate when running with the modified friction plate. Doing so effectively moves the friction plate out enough for it to be driving on the chamfered section of the clutch drum, thus reducing the contact area and accelerating the wear rate, ( it did on my one anyway).
Keep us informed on your progress as it was a most "interesting" noise and I would like to know the outcome.

John.

 

[vince998]

Hi John, Good to hear from you.
Yes, this is still the same noise (sounds worse than it actually is, as it doesn´t seem to be causing any damage (except to the vincent image!!)
When you spaced your plate out with washers, 1.) what washers/shims did you use, & 2.) did you shorten the 9 C15 tubes accordingly?
My last possibility is to fit the old type 1 piece lightning pattern friction plate (if i can find one that doesn´t disintergrate at during the first hard take off!!) and see if this cures the rattle, but this would 1.) probably upset Russ, and 2.) not explain why your dads clutch is perfectly silent using the same component (so i know it can be done )
Thanks John.

 

[Bill Thomas]

Hello Vince, The club do a lightning plate, Bonded on to metal, It won't disintergrate but mine rattles in the drum a bit, Good luck Bill.

 

[A-BCD]

I fitted the VOC Spares Co bonded friction plate, but over a period of 18 months it shed the 'ears' one by one, I noticed on routine checks that it had lost 3, then suddenly I had no clutch - the remaining 7 all snapped off ! Probably over-hardening, I've had the threaded section break off camshaft spindles and the ears snap off a primary chain tensioner blade for the same reason !! Must be unlucky !! I replaced the bonded clutch plate with an old original that has a couple of friction pads missing, but the clutch has never been better - at least for the last 3 years since I fitted it.

 

[John Appleton]

Hi Vince, like everybody else, you have Pete and me mixed up.

John (me) is dad with a silent clutch. Pete is son, also with a silent clutch. We both have the "five eared" bonded steel plate fitted and have experienced no problems. I fitted the washers behind the inner plates just as an experiment as there were witness marks where the shoes had touched at sometime. They were standard stainless washers, and I have since removed them for the reasons given above. I did not shorten the tubes.
To overcome the name confusion, the south Wales S.O. has resorted to calling us the "Appleton Brothers" and we have agreed to answer to either John or Pete, whoever she happens to be talking to, as we do when anybody else mixes us up!

Keep us posted,John (or is it Pete?)

 

[vince998]

Hi John, Sorry for the mix-up (i should have realised from the avatars )

I´ll mess about spacing everything out (shoes from carrier, primary plate from shoes, friction plate from drum etc) and see what happens.
Alternaively, i could just paint everything black and then look for witness marks ;-)

My right arms pumped up like popeyes from un-doing and re-doing the bloody screws.