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E: Engine Comet cams followers and idlers


Chris.R

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Hi again timing chest cover is now off the Cams of my 1954 Comet are MK1 the followers are worn as is the cam profile, I need to have both stellite coated any ideas how long this will take and where best to go for the work to be done please. My Comet also has aluminium large and small idler, and a fibre ADT wheel would also like to replace these. The project moves on slowly.
 

vibrac

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Over the last years when you could still get cams by Garry stellighted he was not bothering with followers and everyone just bought new. Who does cams now? I dont know, I guess thats get new as well, certainly keep the wheels, its not to hard to fit cams to them.
To be controversial I dont think there was much wrong with alloy idlers so long as they were changed before the rot set in and the oil kept fresh, but in the dark days of the sixties they got a bit over used. My take is that if we had always used steel idlers and some bright spark invented alloyones now, the racers would queue up for them! You would be hard pushed to find a new one now,,,
 

Chris.R

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I believe that Maughans will stellite cams at least I have been told to give them a call. If I use a stellite coated cam set on the Comet I will have to match that with Stellite coated followers to be consistent I am going to give Maughans a call on Monday. The story I have is that Stellite cams will quickly wear out standard followers am I correct. To be truthful the Alloy idlers look pretty good no real slop so might be sensible on the pocket to keep them on the other hand I have been told to get the ATD uprated with the superior Acetal wheel.
 

BigEd

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
VOC Forum Moderator
I believe that Maughans will stellite cams at least I have been told to give them a call. If I use a stellite coated cam set on the Comet I will have to match that with Stellite coated followers to be consistent I am going to give Maughans a call on Monday. The story I have is that Stellite cams will quickly wear out standard followers am I correct. To be truthful the Alloy idlers look pretty good no real slop so might be sensible on the pocket to keep them on the other hand I have been told to get the ATD uprated with the superior Acetal wheel.
I what respect is Acetal superior?
 

Chris.R

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
There are two types as I understand it listed in VOC spares I was told that the one is superior and longer lasting than the other, I give way to a more enlightened understanding please.
 

BigEd

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
VOC Forum Moderator
There are two types as I understand it listed in VOC spares I was told that the one is superior and longer lasting than the other, I give way to a more enlightened understanding please.
I don't know if Acetal is superior. I have used a Tufnol fibre gear for 50,000 miles so would it be worth replacing it with an Acetal gear as the prices are not too dissimilar? I have heard that some plastic gears may swell if the wrong grade or type is used.
Someone on the forum may be able to give both of us some more information.
 

Chris.R

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Hi Ed
Maybe another will post a comment for us both:

I can only say that when the timing cover was removed today all the gear train looked in good order on a machine of unknown quantity, what I do know is that the dealer I bought the Comet from had had the mag man refurbish the mag although the ATD looks in good order it is stiff, I will take a photo of it to post in the morning, before it is removed and cleaned in petrol to ease it, it is possible it was overhauled at the same time as the mag, I will also photo the cam and the followers.
 

davidd

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
DSCN2959.jpg
This is my preference: all Maughan gears, phenolic ATD and Maughan large idler boss.

Megacycle cams (this one is Mk2) and club followers. Stellite is not necessary. The cams are hard and the followers are 60 rockwell. These engines redline at 7000 rpm, but with the Mk 2 6000 rpm and the Mk 1 would be around 5500 rpm.

David
 

davidd

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I have had two owners contact me who got acetal gears from the Club that were to small. Has that been dealt with?

David
 

greg brillus

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
If the retaining collar at the rear of the ATD has been pushed on a bit too hard it will restrict the movement, but the cam ring in the mag itself tends to give drag which can make the ATD feel stiff. Best to rotate the mag to a point where the points are closed and check the freedom of the ATD in that spot. The gear pinion of the ATD should have some in/out end float if this is not the case then the collar will be the problem. My preference is the original Tufnol pinion gears over the plastic ones.
 

genedn

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I believe that Maughans will stellite cams at least I have been told to give them a call. If I use a stellite coated cam set on the Comet I will have to match that with Stellite coated followers to be consistent I am going to give Maughans a call on Monday. The story I have is that Stellite cams will quickly wear out standard followers am I correct. To be truthful the Alloy idlers look pretty good no real slop so might be sensible on the pocket to keep them on the other hand I have been told to get the ATD uprated with the superior Acetal wheel.
As noted above Gary was running the Stellited Cams on Maughans followers for the last number of years with few complaints. He told me not so long ago that this is what he would recommend for my twin build.
 
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Ian Savage

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
David, if the gears were bought from the VOC Spares Co why would they need to talk to John at Coventy Spares? If bought from Coventry Spares why did you say they came from the 'Club'. Sorry if I'm getting a bit grumpy over this but I had too many instances of the Spares Co being accused of supplying a 'faulty' part often by a 3rd party only to find the item wasn't bought from us and we didn't even make it.
 
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Chris.R

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Hi photos attached show ATD, Cam and followers, the surface of the followers is worn I guess the hardened surface is worn away, the MK1 Cam end is best described as lumpy worn in ridges. The ATD looks ok apart from its movement being stiff, I note the comments made above, it will have to come off to be certain there are no problems, Given what Vibrac says about alloy idlers mine look pretty good and am now minded to keep them unless better advice comes forward. Remember that for most of its life this old gal from 1954 has been in a museum awaiting rescue.
 

Attachments

stumpy lord

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I believe that Maughans will stellite cams at least I have been told to give them a call. If I use a stellite coated cam set on the Comet I will have to match that with Stellite coated followers to be consistent I am going to give Maughans a call on Monday. The story I have is that Stellite cams will quickly wear out standard followers am I correct. To be truthful the Alloy idlers look pretty good no real slop so might be sensible on the pocket to keep them on the other hand I have been told to get the ATD uprated with the superior Acetal wheel.
To use old unknown alloy idlers is, in my opinion, a false economy. If you had seen the inside of a Vincent engine following the failure of an alloy idler you would not even consider using them, every nook and cranny will be full off alloy dust and that includes the upper frame member. The only way to sort that kind of incident is a complete strip-down and clean.
Stumpy Lord.
 
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