Gents, the motorcycle race starts shortly and can be watched live online here:
https://www.goodwood.com/flagship-events/goodwood-revival/
https://www.goodwood.com/flagship-events/goodwood-revival/
Vincent Racing Calendar
Well I managed to get a couple of shots the better presented Black shadow (47) and the Lightning (15) I did not see the lightning in the race but with a vincent damper at the front and no steering damper vincent or telescopic it was a brave man who took it out.
All in all not a good showing for the marque my comments on the event above still stand they have the clout to get the big motorcycle names in but they dont really know about motorcycles history or racing even the commentator kept on about the age of the third placed Rudge he seemed supprised anyone who follows vintage racing knows how Rudges go, heck I saw Merve the Swerve devour TZ350 yamahas in a race years ago. For those who have never been a rising percentage go in period gear (I have worn my blue drape and brothel creepers on occasion) there are small 'events' all around the race ground and paddock , rock bands, dads army look alikes , Mrs mops dressed as char ladies all done very well except the motorcycle crowd where the most pathetic set of old motorcycles with supposedly hells angels pose , It really does need some old British motorcycle clubs to inject some real nostalgia and glamour and original Barbour suits into the scene
All in all not a good showing for the marque my comments on the event above still stand they have the clout to get the big motorcycle names in but they dont really know about motorcycles history or racing even the commentator kept on about the age of the third placed Rudge he seemed supprised anyone who follows vintage racing knows how Rudges go, heck I saw Merve the Swerve devour TZ350 yamahas in a race years ago. For those who have never been a rising percentage go in period gear (I have worn my blue drape and brothel creepers on occasion) there are small 'events' all around the race ground and paddock , rock bands, dads army look alikes , Mrs mops dressed as char ladies all done very well except the motorcycle crowd where the most pathetic set of old motorcycles with supposedly hells angels pose , It really does need some old British motorcycle clubs to inject some real nostalgia and glamour and original Barbour suits into the scene
The 'concentrics' are from Timetraveller I think.........
Good pictures Tim, Yes both those bikes have the modified stem set up which also does away with the eccentrics. The top photo showing bike number 15 looks exactly how the links and the amount of available spring box travel was on my Rapide, so I put longer lower shocker eye bolts on and this has given it more travel, and with the bike at rest, the links are slightly down at the nose which is what I want. The beauty of this set up is that it allows the suspension to function and also dive under braking which it should do. And the main advantage of this over just changing the springs, is that it increases travel and allows you to soften the front end. Looking at the second photo, I would say that at rest, that bikes front end is likely "Topped out" looking at the amount of rod visible on the shock absorber, which is a Thornton by the look of it, that is also why I opted for the longer eyebolts. It's all experimental, but it seems to be a vast improvement over the stock Girdraulic set up. Now I need to do some comparisons between the front end of the racer verses my Rapide to see how similar they are.
Does the Shadow have " concentrics" for the Girdraulics?
Yes, both bikes have the John Emmanuel mod. but the fact that a 'concentric' is used is not the important part of this. The pivot for the rear of the lower link is moved totally to a different centre which means that the springs are both more upright and the space for them is shorter. I designed in a 'concentric' because I could not imagine any sidecar users going for this modification. On the photographs no. 15 is the Patrick Walker bike, without a steering damper, and no. 47 is the Robert Lusk bike. I have more connection with the latter but both have some of my bits on them. I don't know how Patrick got on but on the Friday his gear change was very stiff and there was not a good time to take too much of it apart. I have emailed him with some suggestions. The Robert Lusk bike finished eighth on Saturday in torrential rain and feed back is that there is enough power. However, on the Sunday the bike was pulled in by the second rider only two laps from the end with oil spray hitting his visor coming out of the oil filler neck. We do not know what the problem is yet as this bike, with a twin start oil pump, has not given this problem before and has a deflector inside the filler cap to try to prevent spray and splash at high revs. It will be investigated in a week or twos time.
Please note that the rear end of both bikes are jacked up significantly to both increase the head angle and to give more clearance for the exhaust pipes.
Greg is correct that with the Thornton damper and 3" of pre-load on the 30 lbs/inch springs the forks are being pushed upwards. However, they do go down when the rider sits on the bike. We need to play around with it a bit more and I think that we will end up with less pre-load. All this is so that we can come up with the best compromise for those who would like to use this mod on the road and get the best comfort that they can. As a starter one can just use the out springs from a normal 'C' pair but the 36lbs/inch springs, as used by Chrislaun, are certainly better. It is only a matter of trying to optimise a system which will suit most people. The fact that one can race without a steering damper shows how much the handling is improved. Just have to try to optimise the comfort now.
Yes, both bikes have the John Emmanuel mod. but the fact that a 'concentric' is used is not the important part of this. The pivot for the rear of the lower link is moved totally to a different centre which means that the springs are both more upright and the space for them is shorter. I designed in a 'concentric' because I could not imagine any sidecar users going for this modification. On the photographs no. 15 is the Patrick Walker bike, without a steering damper, and no. 47 is the Robert Lusk bike. I have more connection with the latter but both have some of my bits on them. I don't know how Patrick got on but on the Friday his gear change was very stiff and there was not a good time to take too much of it apart. I have emailed him with some suggestions. The Robert Lusk bike finished eighth on Saturday in torrential rain and feed back is that there is enough power. However, on the Sunday the bike was pulled in by the second rider only two laps from the end with oil spray hitting his visor coming out of the oil filler neck. We do not know what the problem is yet as this bike, with a twin start oil pump, has not given this problem before and has a deflector inside the filler cap to try to prevent spray and splash at high revs. It will be investigated in a week or twos time.
Please note that the rear end of both bikes are jacked up significantly to both increase the head angle and to give more clearance for the exhaust pipes.
Greg is correct that with the Thornton damper and 3" of pre-load on the 30 lbs/inch springs the forks are being pushed upwards. However, they do go down when the rider sits on the bike. We need to play around with it a bit more and I think that we will end up with less pre-load. All this is so that we can come up with the best compromise for those who would like to use this mod on the road and get the best comfort that they can. As a starter one can just use the out springs from a normal 'C' pair but the 36lbs/inch springs, as used by Chrislaun, are certainly better. It is only a matter of trying to optimise a system which will suit most people. The fact that one can race without a steering damper shows how much the handling is improved. Just have to try to optimise the comfort now.
As I said before our racer is at the half inch of broomstick up the spring box phase but I do use longer eye bolts on the koni front
perhaps by next year when all the deliberations are clear I may re read all the comments on geometry and all the AVO stuff and do some alterations
but race wise its always been as smooth as silk however there are no pot holes at Cadwell
perhaps by next year when all the deliberations are clear I may re read all the comments on geometry and all the AVO stuff and do some alterations
but race wise its always been as smooth as silk however there are no pot holes at Cadwell
In that connection the Patrick Walker bike also has a solid rear end!! His choice, and he tells me that on smooth circuits it handles well enough to not need a steering damper. However, he was having to fight it a bit over some of the bumps at Goodwood so he might end up having to 'modernise' and fit a sprung rear end. For those who don't know, Patrick builds brand new Manx Norton engines (original bore and stroke) and bikes and races them and this is his first foray into Vincents, so he is used to bikes which handle well.
Is it me, or does the L/H brake lever angle look past 90° on the Lusk bike?