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A: Oil Pipework Series D oil tank


macvette

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I use 10/40 in my D. Breather in the standard position. I fill the tank so that the oil just touches the bottom of the block. My chain oiler is blocked off at the tank exit and I use chain lube on the chain. I get slight misting around the breather hole in the cap. I found if I filled the tank much above the bottom of the block, I would get oil running off the cap onto the top of the tank. It wasn't lot but more thsn misting so I lowered the level as above
 

Gary Gittleson

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
David,
I made a simple splash shield out of thin aluminum and it may help a little. Less oil does indeed come out with less oil in the tank but it makes me a little nervous. Mr. Richardson says the capacity is 5 pints. That translates to 6 US pints or 3 US quarts. There's no way the tank will hold that much. I have it off the bike and tested it. At 1.8 US quarts, it's about one inch below the bottom of the filler neck. I don't I should have less oil than that in it. Two quarts seems reasonable.

As to the engine, it's not smoking and the top end is in good shape. Runs quite well. The one-way valve on the breather made a huge difference in oil coming out the usual places. The breather itself hardly produces any oil at all. I was thinking that piping the excess pressure (assuming that's what I have) from the tank to the engine should allow the oil that's carried with it to drop to through the engine and the excess air would be dealt with by the breather. I also think that one advantage of the D breather setup is that its source is high on the engine and less likely to carry oil than one lower down.
Thanks and cheers,
Gary
 

davidd

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Gary,

I think your thought process has been good on this from the beginning. It is the little stuff that you don't want to get caught out on.

I only have a theoretical negative reaction to piping pressure into the crank case. It just seems so wrong! In reality it may be fine.

I don't think I ever put that much oil in a D oil tank, but on the C racer after a complete change I only used two quarts in the tank. I often ran with less. A two thirds full tank is what I designed for on the Egli frames I built.

Pat Manning is not here, but when I opened his D oil cap no oil is visible and I seem to remember that is what I did with mine. "Fill it until you just can't see the oil." It does sound a little odd, but I stuck a plastic flexi ruler down the filler and I hit the oil at 4" down from the top of the filler, which is about 2" down from the top of the tank. I will check with him also.

I think if you can fill it higher like Mcvette does, that is fine. I think more room in the tank is nice, particularly if you have some oil in the sump. You need some room in the tank for it. You might want to do some trial runs to see what you are comfortable with and some other D owners might chime in. I will ask Carleton Palmer who has been riding his D a lot lately.

David
 

Gary Gittleson

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Carleton Palmer! Give him my regards. You can remind him that we met a few times back in the 1970's. Thanks much for your thoughts.
Gary
 

davidd

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I will. I talked to Pat Manning and he said that he rides around with it below the optimal level for the usual rides. He tops up at the end of a ride if hey plans to do a longer ride much like Mcvette mentions. At the end of a ride he assumes the bike's sump is empty, so topping up is not an issue.

I talked to Carleton two weeks ago and I think he is in Mexico right now. His D Shadow has the new steering stem installed and a coil over Works Performance shock on the front. He put a shortened Works coil over on the rear and he can't believe how well the bike handles now.

David
 

Gary Gittleson

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
It's time for me to post an update. I just took a ride of about 90 miles and the bike shows no signs of oil leaks! Kicking my heels!
So I thought I'd post the modifications.

1) I made a "carb slide" gadget similar to David's out of copper pipe by cutting a one-inch piece lengthwise in half, working the shape to fit around the return block in the oil tank and soldering a flat piece to one end. I then drilled a hole for a screw to fasten the device to the block at the metering screw hole. I used a short screw from an old Monobloc carb to hold it down.
2) I obtained a non-breathing oil cap from Coventry Spares
3) I drilled and tapped an old valve inspection cap to take 1/8" US pipe thread (npt), cut a short length of threaded brass pipe, opened the cut end with a drill bit and soldered a piece of brass tubing into that. I installed the modified cap and pipe over the rear exhaust valve. With that in place, I ran a piece of 5/16 rubber hose connecting the chain oiler outlet to the valve cap.
4) My bike is a D, so I already had the valve-cap breather setup. I have it over the intake valve on the front cylinder. I think it's supposed to be over the exhaust valve but I wanted it to be as high as possible.
5) The breather cap is connected to a one-way valve which in turn is connected to a long rubber hose which exits behind the rear axle.

So far, as I mentioned, everything is dry. Even the breather-hose exit is dry. So is the valve lifter cable area.
 

Gary Gittleson

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Sorry about the test. I posted my update yesterday but it didn't seem to work. I'm guessing the GDPR changes wrought a little havoc. Now I do indeed see the update, so I guess it was in limbo for a while.
 

stu spalding

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Does anyone here have an opinion on this mod?
http://www.voc.uk.com/net/docs/4.1/4.1-571-32.pdf

I'm thinking of getting another D-style ET24/6 and after modifying the return block, piping the disabled chain oiler to that. I say "another" because I already have one over the inlet valve on the front cylinder, connected to a hose with a one-way valve and an extension out the back past the rear axle.
Cheers,
Gary
Hi Gary, I've been using this mod on a well ridden twin for many years with no problems at all. It certainly makes overflowing oil tanks a thing of the past. Cheers, Stu.
 

peter holmes

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I would imagine that most of us will have overfilled the oil tank once, and then suffered the consequences, but surely it is not the sort of error that one repeats that regularly that we have to install overflow modification working in much the same way as a toilet cistern does (or used to before they made them with an internal overflow system). I would not really appreciate being the next motorcyclist along the road following someone that had just vented all of his excess oil over the tarmac.
 

Gary Gittleson

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Would you care to clarify this? Overfilled? Before this mod, the only way I could stop overflow at the tank was to run with just a bit over one quart (US) in the system. Are you suggesting that my mod dumps excess oil? That's exactly what I have been trying to avoid. That's not safe for the engine. The tank was far from overfilled, yet there was always oil seeping out the breather hole in the cap. That has stopped. If you had read what I stated, you might have noticed that no oil emanates from the breather hose. The system is now completely self contained and the bike is dry. So is the tarmac.

But no worries. The tarmac I ride on is three thousand miles from yours.
 

peter holmes

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Gary, Just reread Stuarts article and he states that his modification deals with the problem of overfilling the oil tank, I also note that I did not read the article properly as he states that he vents the excess oil back into the engine via a Series D breather cap, I missed that bit before, so no oil on the road, which is great. As your engine is far from overfilled I just wonder if you have a twin start oil pump fitted that is creating so much vertical splash from the returned oil from the scavenge side of the pump into the oil tank.
 

Gary Gittleson

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
No, it is not a twin-start pump. I don't seem to be the only one with the splash problem. See David's posts on this thread. But after I made the splash-inhibitor, I still had excess pressure in the tank, which pushed oil out the breather hole in the cap. That's when I decided that I had to vent the oil tank in another way. I thought that if I could vent the tank back to the valve gear at the top of the engine, any oil carried would simply drop through the engine to the crankcase. I also reasoned that since the crankcase is vented with a one-way valve and is normally at a partial vacuum, the extra pressure coming from the tank should be absorbed.

In any case, it all seems to work and I am also now able to run with an adequate amount of oil in the tank with no noticeable loss.
 

John Cone

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I found the cure to stop oil coming out through the oil tank filler was to put less oil in the tank, i used to have the oil almost level with the return hole but found if the pump scavenges more oil, whats drained in to the crankcase after a period of standing, it then raises the oil level to high and pushes it out of the cap.
 

peter holmes

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I found the cure to stop oil coming out through the oil tank filler was to put less oil in the tank, i used to have the oil almost level with the return hole but found if the pump scavenges more oil, whats drained in to the crankcase after a period of standing, it then raises the oil level to high and pushes it out of the cap.
The solution is only to top up your oil tank after a run, that way you will never overflow due the scavenge side of the oil pump overfilling the tank
 

alpinedino

New Website User
Non-VOC Member
Thanks for your kind comments.
Excuse me translate with google translate.
I deposit oil has no pressure .... but the vent that goes to the chain ejects oil almost 7 meters away from my motorcycle to avoid that I have attached that tube to return the oil to the tank.
the screw inside the tank was fully tightened.
what I do? Can I start the motorcycle without fear of breaking something?
Thanks again
 

b'knighted

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Thanks for your kind comments.
Excuse me translate with google translate.
I deposit oil has no pressure .... but the vent that goes to the chain ejects oil almost 7 meters away from my motorcycle to avoid that I have attached that tube to return the oil to the tank.
the screw inside the tank was fully tightened.
what I do? Can I start the motorcycle without fear of breaking something?
Thanks again
This is in the Series D oil tank thread! Do you have a Series D with the oil tank under the seat, or an earlier model with the oil tank under the fuel tank?
 

timetraveller

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Hola, estaré en España, cerca de Cartagena, pronto. Si vives en cualquier parte de la provincia de Murcia podría visitarpara explicar cómo funciona el sistema petrolero Vincent.
 

vibrac

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Hola, estaré en España, cerca de Cartagena, pronto. Si vives en cualquier parte de la provincia de Murcia podría visitarpara explicar cómo funciona el sistema petrolero Vincent.
Hello, I will be in Spain, near Cartagena, soon. If you live anywhere in the province of Murcia, you could visit to explain how the Vincentian oil system works.
Vibrac adds:
Where is that diagram with all the oil flow and storage areas in a sort of stack?
 

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