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Interesting Egli


bmetcalf

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This bike showed up In Wagrain at the International Rally. Its harley-type starter and apparent belt-driven Lucas alternator are interesting.
 

Pete Appleton

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That is a Kubota alternator, as used in the mcDougalator.
 

davidd

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Bruce,

Thanks! Very interesting. It looks like the starter is a sprag clutch, but I don't have much experience with starters unless they are rollers. Harley makes most of their starters by using sprag clutches. There are some Bendix type starters in use on older bikes. Even the Bendix has a sprag clutch so when the pinion pops into the starter gear it freewheels if it sticks. Otherwise it would back drive the starter. The Harley guys call them "starter clutches" and none of them seem very happy with them. They seem to start the bikes well for a time and then they need replacement. I believe they use a "raceless" roller bearing as the clutch that lives a hard life.

David
 

Bill Thomas

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I had some of those Early Square Gardner Carb's, For me, They worked better than the later nicer looking ones.
Cheers Bill.
 

Bill Thomas

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Are those the ones with the funny needle with a flat on the side that you rotated to tune?
Yes Bruce. The same as the later ones.
So it's strange I found them better.
Good for 130 ish though. Cheers Bill.
 

Bill Cannon

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This bike showed up In Wagrain at the International Rally. Its harley-type starter and apparent belt-driven Lucas alternator are interesting.
Bruce, I am the guilty party! My daughter lives near Wagrain so I only came over on the tuesday and the sunday.
Starter motor is from a BMW F800 but looiks like a generic Lapanese one. Reduction and ring gears and sprag clutch are from a Suzuli Intruder 800., mounted behind the Commando belt drive clutch. Has proved reliable for about 700 miles so far, which is better than my experience with the previous Grosset.

Alternator is a Kubota 140W. I originally tried to run it off the smooth side of the primary bely but it slipped so didn't keep the battery charged. This MkII version, completed on the Saturday I left for Austria, charges well but is causiing a problem with the run of the primary belt, hence I only used it for very short rides.
I have now slimmed down the alternator to move it out of the way of the primary belt which is now one size shorter. I think this should work OK but hasn't been road tested yet.
Cheers Bill
 

peter holmes

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The Egli might belong to Bill Cannon, I was talking with Bill last Sunday, he said he did take a genuine Fritz Egli Vincent to the rally in Wagrain, said it had an aluminium fuel tank and could do with tidying up a little, his words, not mine, so could be one of the same.
 

Bill Cannon

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Are those the ones with the funny needle with a flat on the side that you rotated to tune?
Yes Bruce that's right although the adjustment is against a detent spring so only single full rotations are possible. You can buy different needle holder screws which set the taper at differnet angles relative to the airflow.
 

bmetcalf

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Bill C., do you have any photos of the starter mountings or the alternator to post?

At the Rally, someone was musing about a gear primary drive with the idler driving an alternator. I don't know how the idler revs would work out or how practical that is overall.
 

Bill Cannon

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Shown below, the extended crankcase studs, the MkII version of mounting plate, MkII installation, then MkIII current installation. Alternator is driven approximately double crank speed.
Irving Vincent uses gear drive. Very strong but a lot of work for little gain in the real world I would guess.
 

Attachments

Bill Cannon

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Hi Bill, In the states they are as cheap as chips but here in UK if you shop around you can get them for about £90. Regulator was supplied by the same company to their recommendation ( who I can't remeber) it was about £50.
Cheers Bill
 

vibrac

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Yes Bruce that's right although the adjustment is against a detent spring so only single full rotations are possible. You can buy different needle holder screws which set the taper at differnet angles relative to the airflow.
I had one for a year on the racing Comet as they first came out in 1947-8 it was borrowed from Mr Mogvin (and Mr Gardener was still around four years ago). it was great at full throttle but a bit of an on off switch otherwise. Some of the problem was fuel regulation I did fit a float chamber but they would not allow a matchbox one (>1949 class) so I cobbled together one out of a 276 chamber but in the end I gave it back.If we ever decide to go racing again on the Comet since we are no longer eligible in the girder fork class and they let Egli Vincents in the race and nobody seems to care about championships we might as well use an 1-3/8 GP I guess thats 1950-51 vintage
 

Bill Thomas

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You can use them without floats, Bit like Wal Phillips Injectors, The Tank is the float chamber,
There is a small difference between full tank and low, But not much.
Ron Gardner told me off !, He wanted me to use floats, But he didn't on his test rig, Nice Bloke, I went round his house before I bought my first Square one, But I have always been BAD !.
I had so much shortage of petrol, At the Speed/Rev's I was looking for, With Mk1 concentrics, And even
36mm Dellortos, Till I was told I could use the float valve out of the 40mm jobs,
So I thought theres the tank, Then the pipe, And that's it, I had the 30mm Gardners, Then the 32 mm ones,
Good Power, But a bit of a drip etc + a bit of sticking some times, Slow running not good, But I have seen Bill Cannon's on Video, And his seem better. Cheers Bill.
 

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