G: Gearbox (Twin) Fitting a Grosset starter and machining G46AS

ClassicBiker

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
I have a question about the measurements of the G46AS. One our section members, Pat Bradley, is considering purchasing a Francois Grosset starter kit for his Rapide. Mr. Grosset was kind enough to send Pat the fitting instructions so Pat could determine if he wanted to undertake the work himself. The two things that worried Pat was altering the felt seal cup, which I know is quite easy and offered to either make him one or alter one. The other thing that worried Pat was the machining of the G46AS. I wasn't worried about this either and told Pat that another member had given me a couple of them when he sold his Rapide a few years back and rather than buy one I would just machine up one of those that I had and give it to him. This is where it gets interesting. I measured up the inside diameter of the pinion and made a mandrel that would have 0.003" interference fit so I could machine the recess in option B as described in the instructions. I measured the overall depth of the pinions I have and they both measure 0.495" not the .4" or 10mm as described as STD in the instructions. Is this a misprint in the instructions or do I need to thin the pinion down? Also the 1.181" or 30mm diameter of the ratchet end of the pinion in the instructions measures 1.249" in diameter on both of pinions I have. Is this also misprint or do I need to reduce the diameter as well.
It also occurred to me that I might not actually have the correct pinion and may have been given two kick start pinions from some other make. I've gone through the instructions a couple of times but there is no mention of the starting dimensions, only pick an option, B being the preferred option, and alter accordingly. But the STD on the overall thickness threw me when I measured the pinions I had. The picture of G46AS in the Spares Co. web page looks very much like the one I have, but that doesn't help very much when actual dimensions are in question. Any guidance from someone one who has previously fitted a Grosset starter would be gratefully appreciated.

Steven



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greg brillus

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
Steve the problem that you can have is that everyone you do is different...... I know this does not help........I would carry out the mods as per drawing "B" as this gives more scope for minimal clearances that is a significant issue when fitting these kits. The 30 mm spec for the slimming down of the ratchet itself is necessary as the mating gear on the sprag clutch is smaller. In fact I have had to slim some down even more so it does not hang up on the edge of the seal in the clutch........They are definitely not a "One size fits all" kind of alteration........Cheers......... Greg.
 

Dave61

Well Known and Active Forum User
Non-VOC Member
I have a question about the measurements of the G46AS. One our section members, Pat Bradley, is considering purchasing a Francois Grosset starter kit for his Rapide. Mr. Grosset was kind enough to send Pat the fitting instructions so Pat could determine if he wanted to undertake the work himself. The two things that worried Pat was altering the felt seal cup, which I know is quite easy and offered to either make him one or alter one. The other thing that worried Pat was the machining of the G46AS. I wasn't worried about this either and told Pat that another member had given me a couple of them when he sold his Rapide a few years back and rather than buy one I would just machine up one of those that I had and give it to him. This is where it gets interesting. I measured up the inside diameter of the pinion and made a mandrel that would have 0.003" interference fit so I could machine the recess in option B as described in the instructions. I measured the overall depth of the pinions I have and they both measure 0.495" not the .4" or 10mm as described as STD in the instructions. Is this a misprint in the instructions or do I need to thin the pinion down? Also the 1.181" or 30mm diameter of the ratchet end of the pinion in the instructions measures 1.249" in diameter on both of pinions I have. Is this also misprint or do I need to reduce the diameter as well.
It also occurred to me that I might not actually have the correct pinion and may have been given two kick start pinions from some other make. I've gone through the instructions a couple of times but there is no mention of the starting dimensions, only pick an option, B being the preferred option, and alter accordingly. But the STD on the overall thickness threw me when I measured the pinions I had. The picture of G46AS in the Spares Co. web page looks very much like the one I have, but that doesn't help very much when actual dimensions are in question. Any guidance from someone one who has previously fitted a Grosset starter would be gratefully appreciated.

Steven



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Hi Steven,
I've just fitted my starter kit, my ratchet didn't match the dimensions on François fitting instructions so I just carried on removing small amounts until I could fit the sprag clutch ok & made sure the kickstart ratchet was working ok.
If I remember rightly the drawing showed 10mm as the total dimension including the ratchet teeth but mine was 10mm just on the cog so quite a bit more with the ratchet.
Having said that I'm definitely not an experienced machinist.
Cheers
Dave
 

Peter Holmes

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
I think Dave has got it just about right, I was with Francois a couple of years ago when he fitted my starter, great service and hospitality BTW, anyway he removed an amount of metal, no idea how much, but he then fed a very thin screwdriver between a gap just to make sure that he could spin the ratchet without impedance, he could so it was job done, it seems a very small clearance is all that is required, as with most things Vincent, working to precise measurements from bike to bike can get you in all sorts of trouble.
 

ClassicBiker

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
Ahh, now I understand. Thank you all very much for clearing up my confusion. I can show the results to Pat and let him know that the G46AS is not an issue and if he decides to take the plunge, we've got a good start on it. He will be pleased. Pat has a Swallow Jet 80 sidecar fitted to his Rapide, starting with the left foot kick starter is becoming a bit difficult for him as he is getting on bit.
Steven
 
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