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FBHVC clarification on introduction of E10 petrol for historic vehicles.

BigEd

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
VOC Forum Moderator
I just received this that should be of interest to UK vehicle owners.

PRESS RELEASE
Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs Ltd, PO Box 295, Upminster, Essex, RM14 9DG
Tel: 01708 223111 E-mail: secretary@fbhvc.co.uk Web: www.fbhvc.co.uk
Registered Office: The Barn, Holly Berry House, Hamstall Ridware, Rugeley, Staffordshire, WS15 3SQ Registered in England No 3842316 VAT Reg No. 636 788683
26 February 2021 For immediate release

FBHVC clarifies the introduction of E10 petrol for historic vehicle owners.
After an extensive consultation process, the Department for Transport has announced that they will legislate to introduce E10 petrol as the standard 95-octane petrol grade by 1 September 2021. They will also require the higher-octane 97+ ‘Super’ grades to remain E5 to provide protection for owners of older vehicles. This product will be designated as the ‘Protection’ grade.
The introduction of the 95-octane E10 grade and the maintenance of the Super E5 protection grade will be reviewed by the Government after 5 years to ensure they remain appropriate to the needs of the market. In relation to the E5 protection grade, such a review will examine market developments over the period. HM
Government have sought to reassure FBHVC members and historic vehicle owners that, without a suitable alternative becoming available, it is highly likely the Super E5 protection grade would continue to be available.
Filling stations that stock 2 grades of petrol and supply at least one million litres of fuel in total each year, will need to ensure one product is the Super E5 protection grade. While not all filling stations meet these criteria, almost all towns across the UK will have a filling station that supplies the ‘Super’ grade and currently one major retailer, a national supermarket group, has committed to offer the product. The main exception to this is in certain parts of the Highlands, north and west coast of Scotland, which will be covered by an exemption process and allowed to continue to market the 95-octane E5 grade.
The Federation therefore recommends that all vehicles produced before 2000 and some vehicles from the early 2000s that are considered non-compatible with E10 - should use the Super E5 Protection grade where the Ethanol content is limited to a maximum of 5%. To check compatibility of vehicles produced since 2000, we recommend using the new online E10 compatibility checker: https://www.gov.uk/check-vehicle-e10-petrol
It should be noted that some Super E5 Protection grade products do not contain Ethanol as the E5 designation is for fuels containing up to 5% Ethanol. Product availability varies by manufacturer and geographical location and enthusiasts should check the situation in their location.
For media enquiries, please contact: • Wayne Scott at Classic Heritage PR, 07759 260899. wayne@classicheritagepr.co.uk

About the FBHVC:
The Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs exists to uphold the freedom to use historic vehicles on the road. It does this by representing the interests of owners of such vehicles to politicians, government officials, and legislators both in the UK and (through the Federation Internationale des Vehicules Anciens) in Europe.
There are over 500 subscriber organisations representing a total membership of over 250,000 in addition to individual and trade supporters. All our directors operate in a voluntary capacity supported by our secretary.
Website: www.fbhvc.co.uk
 

LoneStar

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
E10 is the normal product at all US stations, and has been for years. While it's widely disliked for its tendency to attract water and for poor shelf life, classic bikes run perfectly well on it. (Exception - it will destroy fiberglass tanks.)

Not sure why E10 is of such concern in the UK?
 

vibrac

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Grow cerials! not in the UK! All the powers seem to want to do is cover perfectly good land with trees, drown land won from the sea over hundreds of years, drive a stupid railway through even more land when everyone is on Zoom, ban the eating of meat, dump farming set the rest for scrub land for foxes badgers and get our food imported.
 

oilyrag

Active Website User
VOC Member
E10 is the normal product at all US stations, and has been for years. While it's widely disliked for its tendency to attract water and for poor shelf life, classic bikes run perfectly well on it. (Exception - it will destroy fiberglass tanks.)

Not sure why E10 is of such concern in the UK?
So if you are running on this E10 fuel, what have you done to the bike? Changed the ignition timing? Or anything else? What sort of mileage are you doing?
In 2010 on the way to Greece, Roy Jarvis had no choice and filled up with the stuff. He was sure the bike ran like a pig because of it. All reports are full of gloom and doom, it eats fibre glass, the float in the carb and the pipework. Is all this true?
 

Simon Dinsdale

VOC Machine Registrar
VOC Member
VOC Forum Moderator
I took my Shadow (8:1 pistons) to the International in 2019. The bike hated the E10 fuel that was available in Belgium and yes I was careful and didn't use the even higher ethanol content option. Cold starting was suddenly a problem and it was spitting out the carbs and struggling to tickover until the bike warmed up and even then appeared to be down on power. When we got to the 2nd stage in Austria I noticed the Shadow ran fine on the Austrian E10 almost as well as it runs in UK on E5. So not all E10 appears to be the same and I hope we are not going to have to retune the carbs every time we fill up with a different manufacturer / source of fuel.

This was only for a two week period so I cannot comment on dissolved carbs etc.
 

Peter Holmes

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Well it is certainly hydroscopic, and it will quickly destroy old style herringbone fuel pipe, I have never owned a fibreglass fuel tank, but I understand it will destroy those if not treated to prevent this. I still try to always use 4* leaded still available local to me, or the high octane E5 fuels, normally 99 octane, but it looks like the change is a coming and there ain't nothing we can do about it, except moan a little.
 

Robert Watson

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
The biggest problem is that ethanol is hygroscopic (absorbs water) if left to its own devises for too long. It likes to grow little green moldy bits in tiny little orifices, or just everywhere, but bits find their way into small places it shouldn't be. I have run it from time to time, especially if on a longish trip and using the bike pretty consistently. I try for non ethanol fuels when I can but always the last tank or two before winter layup is non ethanol. I run herringbone hose on both post war twins and havent had to change any that I can recall.

Of course you may get different results as my E10 isn't necessarily your E10
 

LoneStar

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
So if you are running on this E10 fuel, what have you done to the bike? Changed the ignition timing? Or anything else? What sort of mileage are you doing?
I have a Black Shadow, and haven't done anything specifically to adapt to E10. CR is 8:1, ignition timing is 37 degrees, and my herringbone fuel lines have survived 20 years. Probably the bike averages a couple of thousand miles per year, but has been doing so since 1999. E10 has been the norm here since c. 2005.

There is concern over plastic floats, but I run them in my Commando and Bonneville carbs without any issues. E10 will attack fiberglass fuel tanks - I had coated the one on my Commando, to prevent this, but apparently missed some spots and the fuel seeped through and bubbled the paint.

Most of the hostility here towards E10 is due to it attracting water (not good for steel tanks), and its tendency to go stale and gum up carbs more quickly than other blends.

I don't know how this experience applies outside the US, as gasoline isn't a tightly-defined product - blends may vary significantly in different locations. But the ethanol itself doesn't prevent a well-running bike.
 

BigEd

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
VOC Forum Moderator
I think the significant statement is, "They will also require the higher-octane 97+ ‘Super’ grades to remain E5 to provide protection for owners of older vehicles."
If you have had no fuel-related problems in the UK running on the lowest grade then you should use the 97+ ‘Super’ grades after September 21st to avoid possibly having up to 10% ethanol in the tank.
I have had no fuel problems running the Rapide on the cheap supermarket petrol so far but will monitor what happens after September.
 

vibrac

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Proud to say I have only used a supermarket for Petrol twice in extremist circumstances in the last 10 years and the last time I was told to remove my helmet while all around were in masks!
I know where all my Esso stations are though...
 

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