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E: Engine ET162 dimensions

Cyborg

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Anyone have or know where I can find the dimensions for ET162 steady plate distance piece?
Please and thank you.
 

Marcus Bowden

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Most certainly not FAKE Bill, the early s/s seat struts were stamped along with rocker caps, girdraulic fork spindles collars too, although later than series "B's". I've even got a gear indicator lever pinch bolt with its number on it, and a 3/8" b.s.f. RFM bolt with the 2BA thread in it for holding the brake switch. I couldn't make stampings that good & neat but do have a lot of stamps down to 1/8" to 3/8" had to re-stamp my own cases as too much polishing, one of those foolish teenage activities, trouble is one has to keep it up occasionally. Last time 2010, waiting for Bob Dunn to do my B/End. Next time doing it myself with plain floating bushes.
bananaman.


P1050287.jpg


P1030800.jpg
 

Bill Thomas

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Just pulling your leg Marcus,
I did the polishing thing just before 1970 On my Blue Bike,
Redid the shape of the bit where the pushrods go in, Did it all by hand !,
But over the years the stones etc made mess of it underneath !,
I still think it's worth doing, Maybe not all over ?.
Cheers Bill.
 

Vincent Brake

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I guess we should not be surprised that Greg has had to deal with all sorts of problems, including variable camshaft lengths. He has no way of controlling what shows up at his door for fixing.

I build with all new gears and spindles. It may seem excessive, but the reliability of these engines is incredible with a new timing chest and I feel that is a very important requirement for a racer. I use only Megacycle cams because of the quality. I use all the Maughan parts for the timing chest, including the big idler boss. I use the shoulder of the large idler boss as the datum, but I have never had a cam that exceeded the height of that datum. In fact, the datum from the idler boss is quite a bit higher than the instruction sheets anticipated, so those stated dimensions are often of little use to someone assembling a new timing chest.

There is no washer called for behind the camshaft between the shaft and the case, but when lining up the followers with the cam lobes I am always forced to install one in that position. This means that I have to install the same size shim under the other gears to keep the steady plate level. Fortunately, the Arbor shims from McMaster Carr are up to the job and I have never found any cupping or softness when using them.

I suppose the answer is that you need an initial datum location when setting up a new timing chest and the shoulder of the large idler boss is quite tall and easy to install in place. If you have to shim behind the cam to align the followers to the lobes then the top plane of the cam gear becomes the new datum that requires the remaining gears to be adjusted to this new dimension with the object of keeping the steady plate flat.

Bill is spot on about the Simmonds nuts on the cam spindle. I run a tap through the nut to score the nylon. I also run them on and off an old cam spindle held in a vice. There is nothing worse than tightening up this nut and having the 5/16" threaded stem break off due to the high friction fit provided by the nylon insert.

David
Thanx for the mcmaster carr, i ordered a bunch of shims today, after having some lasered form C70 hard steel (at a price...) at 0.1 till 0,6mm all diameters...

for spindles i use my own made from Bohler K340 to 62-64 HRC than machine down to suit, and indeed @greg brillus you are right when 0,05 interf fit it bulbs a bit at the cylinder surface, (scraped down) but a new case will hold it better. After machineing sometimes i do Nitride them to 70Hrc. (annealing K340 is only at 550degr)

when one wants two properities in a part (hard surface and though middle), i made two parts, get rid of the nyloc nut and made bolts from 1000N/mm2 (say 12.9 bolt) with M8x1 and hole 2 mm.
when one carbonize the standard spindles, one should blank off the thread, but thats cumbersome, so not done, so now and than it snaps. (nicht zu verwirren mit Schnaps @erik )
CheersIMG_20210106_204158.jpg
 
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oexing

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
When you do your own spindles get case hardening steel. Just machine all diameters you want to carbonize with some oversize for grinding. Don´t finish the threaded end and any other parts you´d like to stay soft. The heat treating company is not keen on doing protective coats. So you just do all sizes which need carbonizing and order ONLY carbonizing but no hardening yet. Get back your items and do all other sizes for semi finishing , oil holes, so only then you can have items hardened. You could do thread cutting even then as only some dimensions will be hard which got carbonized earlier. Protecting coats will be a risky way so better avoid this step and do as I suggested.

Vic
 

Robert Watson

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
McMaster Carr sent me a shipment (Screws for the Rudge primary case!) about a year ago, and by the time they realized it was going out of the US it was already in transit. There was a pile of paperwork and things to do if I ever wanted to buy from them again, it seems mostly to do with any of their products being used as parts of either military or sensitive industrial products for a foreign nation.
 

ClassicBiker

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
It falls under ITAR. Which stands for International Traffic in Arms Regulation. Anything that could potentially be used in a weapons system is strictly controlled. McMaster Carr gets around having to deal with the regulations by not exporting or exporting very little. If you intend to export or ship any item out of the U.S. you either have to demonstrate that it is not possible or intended to be used in a weapons system of any kind. Things like screws, shims, springs, etc are scrutinized closely. Where they are going, who they are going to, will they be exported from there to a third party. It is a right pain sometimes. Particularly if you do not have an export license. Software and cnc machinery is also heavily scrutinized as well.
 

oexing

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
I have stopped ordering anything from USA almost completely, even via Ebay who do all financial jobs around exports. Mostly shipping costs charged by the seller are outrageous very often. A lot cheaper to send to Australia from EU really. Military aspects in USA look ridiculous when dealing with exports , seeing that enormous weapon exports go to the Middle East from there.
Anyway, very nice shims can be ordered by getting axial needle bearings. They are all 1 mm thickness, just bin the axial races and keep the shims. Complete bearing sets seem to be cheaper than trying to get just the shims for them. For below 1mm shims you could get feeler gage material, these are spring steel so allright for axial loads - unlike with normal packing shims from soft steel. But it is quite some job to shape spring steel material to size.
Often I turn special spacers from rounds and harden them at home with a torch , no rocket science at all. Some links below to get ideas maybe :

Vic
Spring steel blade

Axial bearing

Axial bearing set

lots of sizes from Ali:
bearing sets
 

Cyborg

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Why should any supplier bother to stock these items if punters are going to buy one and make the rest themselves?
Ray
Assuming you have followed this thread, do you still think folks shouldn’t make their own? I guess the same question goes for anyone who liked your post. Although this thread turned out to be very informative thanks to those that contributed in a positive way, I think it is unfortunate that folks who don’t have something positive to say, feel the need to chime in. It tends to drive technical discussions off line. Or perhaps discourage them completely.
 

greg brillus

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
A lot of small parts, bushes, studs etc, you can make and modify yourself if you have a lathe......more if you have the equipment and the skills to use them, but most other parts you have to buy and often custom finish to size anyway........It is pretty rare to assemble anything of a sizable nature on these bikes and not expect to have to do this. Anyone who has built up a new engine from all new parts would know this for sure.
 

Bill Thomas

Well Known and Active Website User
VOC Member
Yes, I think this thread must have helped a lot of people, Including me !.
We need to know as much as possible about this Tricky place.
Who would have thought such a small part would give us so much Info'/ Trouble !.

In 1969 I tried to be Clever, It was before the factory made over size inner ends on the Cam Spindles,
I made my own Cam spindles from Stainless steel, With oversize ends, On a Wonky lathe !,
Thinking Stainless would work harden ?, I now know there are many types of stainless !!,
Huge mistake !, Didn't last very long, Funny the Soft oilite bushes wore them out !!.
We Live and Learn, But only by Talking about things !!.
Cheers Bill.
 

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