Misc: Everything Else Complete Restoration of a Black Shadow

Magnetoman

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
Be honest and ask yourself
Be honest with myself!? My, that's asking a lot.

We all have our own priorities or preferences.
Yes, that's exactly the point. Two years ago I rode a 90-year old motorcycle across the U.S. Motorcyclists are a small percentage of the overall population, and only a small percentage of them would have chosen to do that. I did it on a motorcycle for which not much technical information exists, that I had completely rebuilt myself down to the last fastener. Having Vintage Brake install new brake linings was the only thing I didn't do myself. Again, such a rebuild is something only a small number of motorcyclists would be interested in doing. This paragraph is just a long way of saying, my preferences aren't shared by very many motorcyclists.

When I can no longer do that kind of ride (not in the near future I hope ) maybe I'll pass my time by removing modifications I've done and restore my Rapide to original or a good standard. That is not my priority at present,
It makes me sad to think they will all be boiled back to standard to look like that collection in the shed at Stevenage in 1950
I take it that vibrac is the author of 'The Vincent Black Shadow' (Amberley, 2017), which I took the opportunity to re-read yesterday afternoon. Leaving aside the introductory material about the factory, and the final pages about successors, footnotes, etc. (and the 'Del-Autos' typo), fully 40% of the book is devoted to 'Modifications' and 'More Modifications'. Even without that "evidence," the author's personal preference for molested, as opposed to unmolested, Vincents comes through quite clearly at various places in the text. Which is fine, because preferences and priorities are individual choices.

In addition to the satisfaction of having completely rebuilt it myself, I wanted my Ariel to give me the experience of riding a 90-year old motorcycle across the country, not the experience of a motorcycle that had modern improvements applied to it. I want my Vincent to give me the experience of riding a 1950 Vincent, not one that has been modified with 12 V electrics, Mikuni carburetors, altered suspension, etc. Those are my preferences, although clearly they are not shared by everyone.

A worry I had before I started this thread, which only has been amplified by some of the posts, is that my attempt to describe restoring a Vincent to stock configuration easily could degenerate into regular posts every step of the way by people insisting on what I "should do," what they "would do" (i.e. to "improve" it from standard), etc. That would be no fun for anyone.
 

Roslyn

Well Known and Active Forum User
Non-VOC Member
Be honest with myself!? My, that's asking a lot.

Yes, that's exactly the point. Two years ago I rode a 90-year old motorcycle across the U.S. Motorcyclists are a small percentage of the overall population, and only a small percentage of them would have chosen to do that. I did it on a motorcycle for which not much technical information exists, that I had completely rebuilt myself down to the last fastener. Having Vintage Brake install new brake linings was the only thing I didn't do myself. Again, such a rebuild is something only a small number of motorcyclists would be interested in doing. This paragraph is just a long way of saying, my preferences aren't shared by very many motorcyclists.

I take it that vibrac is the author of 'The Vincent Black Shadow' (Amberley, 2017), which I took the opportunity to re-read yesterday afternoon. Leaving aside the introductory material about the factory, and the final pages about successors, footnotes, etc. (and the 'Del-Autos' typo), fully 40% of the book is devoted to 'Modifications' and 'More Modifications'. Even without that "evidence," the author's personal preference for molested, as opposed to unmolested, Vincents comes through quite clearly at various places in the text. Which is fine, because preferences and priorities are individual choices.

In addition to the satisfaction of having completely rebuilt it myself, I wanted my Ariel to give me the experience of riding a 90-year old motorcycle across the country, not the experience of a motorcycle that had modern improvements applied to it. I want my Vincent to give me the experience of riding a 1950 Vincent, not one that has been modified with 12 V electrics, Mikuni carburetors, altered suspension, etc. Those are my preferences, although clearly they are not shared by everyone.

A worry I had before I started this thread, which only has been amplified by some of the posts, is that my attempt to describe restoring a Vincent to stock configuration easily could degenerate into regular posts every step of the way by people insisting on what I "should do," what they "would do" (i.e. to "improve" it from standard), etc. That would be no fun for anyone.
It is getting harder now to find original parts to put the bike back to stock
 

Magnetoman

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
In a post he later deleted, someone who shall remain nameless wrote:

"So there are plenty of those bikes to look at. And since they are all trying as hard as possible to be stock- after awhile if you've seen one you've seen them all."

That sentiment pretty much summarizes why, ironically, the Vincent forum may not be receptive to a thread on the restoration of a Vincent.
 

LoneStar

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
In a post he later deleted, someone who shall remain nameless wrote:

"So there are plenty of those bikes to look at. And since they are all trying as hard as possible to be stock- after awhile if you've seen one you've seen them all."

That sentiment pretty much summarizes why, ironically, the Vincent forum may not be receptive to a thread on the restoration of a Vincent.

Many of us forum readers share your preference for an original bike. It's probably a minority position among active posters, though, partly because modifying bikes provides more material for ongoing discussion. There are always new products and technologies that can be applied to update the Vincent.

Still, there remains much to be learned about restoring to original. I for one would be grateful if you can share your experiences in a public forum.
 

Magnetoman

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
Many of us forum readers share your preference for an original bike. It's probably a minority position among active posters, though, partly because modifying bikes provides more material for ongoing discussion.
To be clear, once I restart work on my Black Shadow my intention will be to restore it as close as possible to original 1950 condition, not to incorporate "reasonable modifications" that many readers of this site feel are important. I realize this decision isn't universally popular here. Despite that, if I do decide to create that thread and post it here, I hope everyone will respect that mine was an informed decision not made out of ignorance of the alternatives. By all means anyone who feels it is unreasonable not to make "reasonable modifications" should discuss their personal preferences, but I strongly hope it will be in threads other than the one I create so as not to detract from what I would like to accomplish.

This present thread has been very helpful, and I greatly appreciate everyone who has been taking the time to contribute to it.
 

Dave61

Well Known and Active Forum User
Non-VOC Member
To be clear, once I restart work on my Black Shadow my intention will be to restore it as close as possible to original 1950 condition, not to incorporate "reasonable modifications" that many readers of this site feel are important. I realize this decision isn't universally popular here. Despite that, if I do decide to create that thread and post it here, I hope everyone will respect that mine was an informed decision not made out of ignorance of the alternatives. By all means anyone who feels it is unreasonable not to make "reasonable modifications" should discuss their personal preferences, but I strongly hope it will be in threads other than the one I create so as not to detract from what I would like to accomplish.

This present thread has been very helpful, and I greatly appreciate everyone who has been taking the time to contribute to it.

All I can say is it`s your bike & your life, do it whatever way makes you happy.
I don`t think anyone on here is intentionally nasty, there can be very dry humour & there is a bias towards riding in the real world which explains the acceptance of modifications but at the end of the day we all like Vinnies & can appreciate someones efforts even if it wouldn`t necessarily be our cup of Tea.
We can all learn from each other so I`ll be watching with interest.
Cheers
Dave

PS. My Rapide probably has every modification you can do to one but I don`t expect everyone to be happy with it :)
 

timetraveller

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
There will be no 'bloodbath' concerning the steering head originating with me. Despite the fact that this modification improves both comfort, handling and safety I have only sold about 200 of these. I assume that most of those who have bought them are riders rather than collectors and are suspicious that the appearance will be changed. In fact the appearance is hardly noticeable and I had looked at John Emmanuel's bike over several years before I noticed what he had done. What about internal mods. The rocker bushes were known to be a problem for years and one has a choice of boring the tunnels and using oversized bushes or using the mod which clamps the bush to the tunnel roof. How about the clutch. My mod of using a needle roller thrust race is inside and invisible but it will not give an original feel. How about the sealing to prevent oil leaking into the clutch. Early was bad, 'D' was better, my mod even better. Sealing the valve lifter boss at the rear of the timing cover. It can be modified internally to prevent leaks but will not leak like the original. It is MM's bike and he can restore it to whatever state he sees fit. That is nothing to do with the rest of us, but he will have a bike that is less usable than it could be.
 

Magnetoman

Well Known and Active Forum User
VOC Member
he will have a bike that is less usable than it could be.
That depends entirely on a person's definition of 'usable', and yours is different than mine. As an example of an original 1950 Black Shadow, mine will be more usable than a modified machine. As a motorcycle to ride across the country, even an extensively "upgraded" Black Shadow would be less usable than a new BMW. Since my goal is to have mine exactly as usable as it would have been when it left the factory in 1950, all of the modifications you mentioned would make it less usable for that purpose.
 
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